fuselage welding

[Pops]

When I was doing that work when I was in my 20's and 30' and about 15 getting killed on a power plant construction job was about normal. In about 1970 we did the math and it was safer for every hour on the job in Vietnam war than what we were doing. Lots of my friends got killed.
In setting steel, I would do the walk up the steel with about 75 lbs on my tool belt to the top of the vertical steel beam and hold on with one hand and stick a spud wrench in a bolt hole and climb up and stand on the spud wrench and land the next cross beam. The steel went to 400 ' to the top of the boiler building. The hardest was sliding down a hanger rod to put the clevis pin in when hanging the two 157 ton headers at 318' elevation. Slide down the rod like a fireman going down a pole to the clevis fork at the bottom and stand on the top of the fork and install the large heavy pin. The headers were the first part of the boiler that went in the building
Have worked building smoke stacks to 1268' and free climbed radio and tv towers.
OHSA regulations saved a lot of lives in construction.
At the time I was in top shape, all muscle at 193 lbs and 6' tall, 32' waist. Now all flab at 220 lbs with a 40" waist. What happen

 

[Daleandee]

Thousands of 4130 fuselages have been welded, successfully, by total amateurs. If you have fairly steady hands, it is straight forward to learn. One could be welding on an airplane very quickly.


BJC

I've been following this thread with much interest.

I have little to no O/A welding experience. Years ago, fresh out of high school, I worked for General Dynamics and was a certified mig welder (4 positions) using a hand torch and/or track set machine.

Recently a family member gifted me a O/A set-up (I wanted to borrow it and they said "come get it - it's yours") with a Victor torch. I'm gonna get the bottles filled, get some scraps and start seeig if I can learn how to weld again. I've considered a course at the local tech college.

So if things go according to plan perhaps I'll get to start on the metal fuse for that Pietenpol I've been dreaming about for so long.

You post sparks my hope that I can make this happen. Thanks ...

 

[BJC]

Recently a family member gifted me a O/A set-up (I wanted to borrow it and they said "come get it - it's yours") with a Victor torch.

I welded up a fuselage, with my Victor torch, about 55 years ago. Enjoyed most of it. One time I didn’t notice that I had left a tube marked with some black PVC tape. Had my head and one shoulder inside the fuselage truss, unknowingly heated the tape, and instantly got nauseous. Shut off the torch quickly, but still puked before I could get out.

One can build all the 4130 parts of a typical HBA with OA. If welding with a TIG, which is nice, one likely will also need an OA or MAPP torch to bend pieces or stress relieve certain pieces like the engine mount.


BJC

 

[wsimpso1]

I've been following this thread with much interest.

I have little to no O/A welding experience. Years ago, fresh out of high school, I worked for General Dynamics and was a certified mig welder (4 positions) using a hand torch and/or track set machine.

Recently a family member gifted me a O/A set-up (I wanted to borrow it and they said "come get it - it's yours") with a Victor torch. I'm gonna get the bottles filled, get some scraps and start seeig if I can learn how to weld again. I've considered a course at the local tech college.

So if things go according to plan perhaps I'll get to start on the metal fuse for that Pietenpol I've been dreaming about for so long.

You post sparks my hope that I can make this happen. Thanks ...

If the set is old, the bottles are probably out of hydro test. Look for the last hydro test date. If past or anywhere near expiring, most of us are best off simply trading bottles. Set -em on the dock and take full set.

Billski

 

[Pops]

If the set is old, the bottles are probably out of hydro test. Look for the last hydro test date. If past or anywhere near expiring, most of us are best off simply trading bottles. Set -em on the dock and take full set.

Billski

That is what I do.

 

[Modelmaker55]

I have a question about O/A welding equipment. I have a Victor torch set with an oxygen and acetylene bottles. I have always used it for cutting only. I have a Lincoln 225 for my welding needs. The first question, is there an appropriate size handle for welding. My handle with a welding tip seems very large and somewhat heavy. I have seen the small torches HVAC and plumbers use to solder and that looks like a nice size to get into tight spaces. Will it work? I assume changing to my larger bottles for welding convenience.

Second question, is can I substitute propane for acetylene when welding? When I got my torch set, I was just a poor new college graduate with a new wife and a child. I could not afford both an oxygen and acetylene bottle so used propane to cut. It was a little slower but worked. Would it impact welding?

Last question, someone suggested one of the Sport Air Workshops to get started. Will it provide enough hands on to feel confident to practice at home and be successful.

Thank you all with far more experience in this aircraft welding world.

Jeff

 

[BJC]

is there an appropriate size handle for welding.

I have an old version of this https://store.cyberweld.com/products/victor-torch-handle-j-28-light-duty-0382-0127 and it worls, but I have a personal preference fo a Smith. https://www.weldingstore.com/produc...MI_qOUsIa0hQMVap9aBR0NCwq3EAQYAiABEgJDpfD_BwE

can I substitute propane for acetylene when welding?

I doubt that propane gets hot enough for welding; never heard of anyone using it.

Get the light weight hoses.

There are others here with more experience; please chime in.


BJC

 

[TFF]

You want the small torch. The big one will melt everything in site. Propane isn’t the right gas. You will struggle and not know why. Not enough heat, so you end up over soaking everything but the weld area trying to get it to melt. A workshop will give yourself a vocabulary on the subject. How well you adapt is about you. What a workshop will do is let you practice under someone who can guide you on what you lack. You might be a duck to water or you might need to practice often. That part is unknown.

 

[Hot Wings]

Look for the last hydro test date.

One of my weird interests was to look at the hydro date of all of my O2 bottles when exchanged to see how old they were.
Kind of amazing how old some of them are. Wasn't uncommon (as of 15 years ago) to get bottles with the first stamp in the 1800's.

All of mine are half full - and out of date.

 

[BJC]

All of mine are half full - and out of date.

Get busy. Use them on some airplane project. (Said the guy who hasn’t welded in 50 years.)


BJC

 

[raven007]

One of my weird interests was to look at the hydro date of all of my O2 bottles when exchanged to see how old they were.
Kind of amazing how old some of them are. Wasn't uncommon (as of 15 years ago) to get bottles with the first stamp in the 1800's.

All of mine are half full - and out of date.

the oldest i have right now is a CO2 who's first stamp is 1928. pretty cool still.

concerning oxy-propane. propane just burns *different* it isn't as hot and the cone is not as focused.

get the lightest handle and hose setup that will provide the heat needed for your welds. an extra 8-10 ounces being dragged around can mean the difference of fatigue setting in after two hours vs three. If you can stay in the groove for three hours at a time vs two, your welds will improve quicker and your productivity will be higher. Even if you love and adore welding, every big project done alone becomes a slough through the trenches at some point. Don't let an overweight setup add to the fatigue level.

 

[JgregP]

The EAA workshops use the Smith #2 torch for O/A welding.

 

[Modelmaker55]

Thank you all for the insight. I felt the big torch handle was too large and heavy but works well for two hands when cutting. I have some things to check out.
Jeff

 

[TFF]

Welding airplane stuff is a magnitude smaller than the big torch. Big torch is what you would use to work on a trailer. Smaller than airplane work is more like art pieces, getting close to jewelry. The correct range makes life easier. The temperature might be the same, but the volume of heat is different. Our pieces are very thin. It doesn’t take much volume to do the work. Get some light weight hoses for the small torch, so nice not to carry the anchor of big hoses doing light work.

 

[Kamcoman77]

As suggested by another member, this is the torch to get..... Smith AW1A. Sometimes you can find them used on Internet sales sites. I got mine a few years ago with three tips for $50

 

[BJC]

I got mine a few years ago with three tips for $50

Good find. I’m sure that there are better words to describe the difference, but I found the Smith flame to be a little longer and softer than my Victor.


BJC

 

[Lauren Williams]

There is one thing that I haven't heard mentioned!, always shut off the oxygen first and also install a backflow preventer between your torch and the acetylene hose. If your kit didn't come with one it's worth a special trip to the welding store. I witnessed a shop fire when the 'O' rings in an old torch failed and a friend came running out of the shop yelling, "Run, it's going to blow!" Sure enough he was cutting, had shut off the wrong gas first, the torch snapped, the oxygen went through/around the 'O' rings and ran up the acetylene hose, carrying a fire front with it. Very quickly the the fire blew out the regulator on the acetylene tank and the resulting bigger fire melted one of the soft plugs on the top of the acetylene tank. The resulting jet-like flame went throught the corrugated steel roof and eighty feet high. Befriend an experienced welder and ask him to show you some basic procedures and pressures.

 

[BJC]

always shut off the oxygen first

You sure about that?


BJC

 

[Kamcoman77]

Here is a photo showing the relative size difference among three torches. After JB-Welding brass fittings and check valves to a $10 Chinese torch I shortened the tip tube to make it more user friendly on aircraft fuselage work (2nd pic).

 

[Hot Wings]

You sure about that?

Maybe I've been doing it wrong (?) but the way I was taught* and it has worked for me since I was single digit in age:

At the torch turn off the O2 first. No pop but you get some smoke.
At the tank turn off the acetylene first. There is a reason we only turn on the ''T' handle a 1/4 turn.
There shouldn't be anything flammable in the welding area other than the acetylene** for the O2 to mix with.

* by my father and the same in class at the local college years later.
** or my fringed pant legs.